Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

draco fett wrote:

That would be animal cruelty. And you could not knock out a rabbit with a BB.

That all depends on what type of BB gun you are using. While most of the airsoft guns nowadays are pretty harmless, I have 1 in my closet that could most likely knock out a rabbit. It leaves a hell of a welt on a human anyway.

Good... Bad... I'm the one with the gun.
Hail to the King Baby!!

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Yeah, but you'd have to be a damn good shot to knock out a small animal with something like that.

  If you want to go small game hunting, a .22 cal rifle is probably the best thing to use.  anything larger is overkill, and anything smaller would not have a good enough chance of killing it. 

A BB gun is generally thought of as the 4.3 mm variety, like the type used in the 'Red Rider' air guns.

BB's are commonly mistaken as pellets, and vice versa, but pellets  guns use C02, and are considerably more powerful.  Pellet guns can be used for hunting, while BB and airsoft guns are mostly recreational.

If ya love me . . .And ya know me . . . And ya've seen me . . .
I'm Old Gregggggggg!

28 Reply by Force Master R (edited by Force Master R Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:42 am)

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

The Yautja wrote:

I also do not like to see animals suffer from someones malice or carelessness.  I have quite a few pets myself, and I like most animals.  (Except dogs)  I enjoy hunting because it's a challenge, just like many of the other things I do.   When you hunt, you are always taught to kill the animal as quickly as possibly in order to cause it as little discomfort as possible.

Force Master R,  you do have some very good arguments, but what exactly do you mean when you say tweak?  You keep saying it, and I have to admit, it is slightly annoying.

By "tweak" I mean I like to annoy people by posting or saying comments that use ones own comments against them in a debate.  For example, I had a friend brag that their brother was perfectly behaved vs my little brother who was a terror.  I responded by saying that children who are too perfect as children grow up to be Sociopaths.  She said that she was perfect as a child. I responded with "I rest my case."  It also works in the same way I posted in response to Fetterthanyou, who was a good sport about it.

Devil Girl: Bravo! I enjoy talking (or in this case, posting) with people who can keep a level head in a debate and who can cook a good steak as well.

and by the way, has the subject changed from "hunting and peta" to "could I knock out a rabbit with a red rider at 5 yards"?

All for one, and that one is me!

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Force Master R wrote:

She said that she was perfect as a child. I responded with "I rest my case."  It also works in the same way I posted in response to Fetterthanyou, who was a good sport about it.

"I rest my case" is one of the greatest lines of all time. Not only does it make most people pause in thought, but it is a great way of completely destroying someone with their own words. And as for being a good sport, I usually never get riled up about debates unless somebody is completely undeniably wrong... and they deny it. So as long as there is a captivating response on the other side, I'm good.

Force Master R wrote:

and by the way, has the subject changed from "hunting and peta" to "could I knock out a rabbit with a red rider at 5 yards"?

I think I could do it.

But as for PETA, all I can think of for the moment is the South Park episode where PETA has a community where they marry the animals and save Stan's horse while he is starving and dehydrated. While I really don't think they go that far, they have been known to do completely stupid things and that just makes me wonder why they think their activism is any better than what they are fighting?

Good... Bad... I'm the one with the gun.
Hail to the King Baby!!

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

blah, blah

You've been holding out on us again haven't you? Since you haven't given us enough money, I'll guess I'll have to take it out of you piece by piece! - Unknown Mandalorian.

green helmeted fett's Website

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Green, that is completely spam. As stated previously, I have to report you.

I'm sure some types of BBguns could knock out a rabbit, especially with pellets,  but it would have to be one of the more powerful kinds.

take it easy baby take it as it comes

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

green helmeted fett wrote:

blah, blah

Now look here.  You are really starting to **** me off.  Everyone here has been extremely patient with you and your spamming, and has tried to help you.  If you're not going to learn, you'd better leave the site now, because it's only going to go downhill from here.

If ya love me . . .And ya know me . . . And ya've seen me . . .
I'm Old Gregggggggg!

33 Reply by Force Master R (edited by Force Master R Wednesday, May 30, 2007 11:17 am)

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

green helmeted fett wrote:

blah, blah

The Yautja wrote:

Now look here.  You are really starting to **** me off.  Everyone here has been extremely patient with you and your spamming, and has tried to help you.  If you're not going to learn, you'd better leave the site now, because it's only going to go downhill from here.

There's a good debate idea, "What should be done with spammers, trolls, and those noobs who cuss unceasingly in online video games?"

All for one, and that one is me!

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Please continue to report offending posts, rather than take the issue too much into your own hands. The best approach here is to ignore the tangents and continue to lead a quality, forward discussion. Thanks. smile

Founder/Editor, BFFC
aaron@bobafettfanclub.com

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Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Force Master R wrote:

There's a good debate idea, "What should be done with spammers, trolls, and those noobs who cuss unceasingly in online video games?"

They should all be thrown in the pit of dispair. But seriously I can't stand those people. Especially the Screamers who just yell into the mic for no reason. Seriously why, it just makes you look like an idiot and can get u banned after a while. There is no point to it.

Thye need to install the punch-o-matic. If you computer / game console picks up any spam, trolling, or completely annoying online behavior it throws a punching glove and socks you in the face. Oh if only...

Good... Bad... I'm the one with the gun.
Hail to the King Baby!!

36 Reply by Force Master R (edited by Force Master R Wednesday, May 30, 2007 2:19 pm)

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Fetterthanyou wrote:

Thye need to install the punch-o-matic. If you computer / game console picks up any spam, trolling, or completely annoying online behavior it throws a punching glove and socks you in the face. Oh if only...

I personaly favor a "blue screen of death" with the message "You are a moron. Your harddrive has been erased as punishment. Have a nice day."

And as for peta, I think that any organization that tries to promote there cause by using a combonation of petty insults, illogical comparisons, and terrorist tactics is not to be taken seriously, exept for charges of criminal stupidity.

All for one, and that one is me!

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

I agree with my bro on this one the "Blue screen of death"is hard to beat and moron is just so fun to use.
http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w90/albenjammin/blue.jpg

...I live by one rule and it is this: Freedom. Enslave no one and be no ones slave. No more no less. I am a hunter and no one rules me.  - Alo Fett

Alo Fett's Website

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Very classy.

[i]Like I told your captain, the orphange attacked me.  It was self-defense.[/i]  -Richard the Warlock  [url]http://archive.lfgcomic.com/lfg0002.gif[/url]

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

And stylish.

"Your passions give you strength, and through strength you gain power. You have seen it, you feel it. You must break your chains."

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Force Master R wrote:

Devil Girl: Bravo! I enjoy talking (or in this case, posting) with people who can keep a level head in a debate and who can cook a good steak as well.

Thank you smile

I think that the more level headed that you can stay the better you can get your point across. I managed to have a drunken debate with someone about fox hunting and not only did we both have a reasoned debate but neither of us got mad. We both enjoyed it and even though none of us changed our points of view it was still enjoyable.

Hehe when I used to cook the steaks I just used to chuck them under the grill and hope for the best lol (thankfully I had no complaints and no one was sick)

Anyway for the next discussion, what do you think about animal testing? (Both cosmetic testing and medical testing)

I do not agree with cosmetic testing as now I do not think there is any need for it any more. Surely there should be enough items that have already been proved to be safe to mix and match those to get something new.

As for medical testing, I do not believe that animal testing is the most efficient way of testing something. Animals have a different system than us so you cannot be sure that how it works on the will be the same as on us. There was a case in England last year where a drug had been tested on animals but the human testing stage went disastrously wrong ( http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4807042.stm )

I do not know what would be a better way but there must be a better way.

Jedi photographer - May the focus be with me.
[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/devil_girl/]Photographs[/url]

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

yes I agree that we stop animal testing but I think why they still do it is just in case something go's bad they know.(Pluse animals don't sue).

...I live by one rule and it is this: Freedom. Enslave no one and be no ones slave. No more no less. I am a hunter and no one rules me.  - Alo Fett

Alo Fett's Website

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Medical testing on animals doesn't make any sense to me.  As Devil Girl said human and animal immune systems are completely different.  It's so ridiculous that there has to be a good reason for it.  That's all I can say.

[i]Like I told your captain, the orphange attacked me.  It was self-defense.[/i]  -Richard the Warlock  [url]http://archive.lfgcomic.com/lfg0002.gif[/url]

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Sev Fett wrote:

Medical testing on animals doesn't make any sense to me.  As Devil Girl said human and animal immune systems are completely different.  It's so ridiculous that there has to be a good reason for it.  That's all I can say.

I think it is sadly more to do with that animals are seen as being dispensable.

Jedi photographer - May the focus be with me.
[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/devil_girl/]Photographs[/url]

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

I'm pretty sure that it's because they would rather accidentally kill an animal than a human.   Unless they can figure out a way to test procedures or what have you, I don't see how you can make any progress in any scientific or medical fields.

If ya love me . . .And ya know me . . . And ya've seen me . . .
I'm Old Gregggggggg!

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Devil Girl wrote:
Sev Fett wrote:

Medical testing on animals doesn't make any sense to me.  As Devil Girl said human and animal immune systems are completely different.  It's so ridiculous that there has to be a good reason for it.  That's all I can say.

I think it is sadly more to do with that animals are seen as being dispensable.

I'm 100% sure that some people do see animals this way, but I don't think that is the reason they do it. They do it because it is better to cause harm to an animal than another human. At least that is the idea, and I agree with that. If there really is the technology to test things in other ways, not only do they do that, but they also test it on the animals just to make sure.

They also test products on homeless people because they are willing to do anything for the money. Do you think that is wrong? Because I think that if they are willing to risk themselves for the bettering of technology, and it helps them economically... There is nothing wrong with it.

Good... Bad... I'm the one with the gun.
Hail to the King Baby!!

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Plus, if they AGREE to do it to themselves then it should be fine. Animals don't do it willingly.

Est Sularus Oth Mithas
I am a Role Playing Gamer, like my father before me.

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Fetterthanyou wrote:
Devil Girl wrote:
Sev Fett wrote:

Medical testing on animals doesn't make any sense to me.  As Devil Girl said human and animal immune systems are completely different.  It's so ridiculous that there has to be a good reason for it.  That's all I can say.

I think it is sadly more to do with that animals are seen as being dispensable.

I'm 100% sure that some people do see animals this way, but I don't think that is the reason they do it. They do it because it is better to cause harm to an animal than another human. At least that is the idea, and I agree with that. If there really is the technology to test things in other ways, not only do they do that, but they also test it on the animals just to make sure.

They also test products on homeless people because they are willing to do anything for the money. Do you think that is wrong? Because I think that if they are willing to risk themselves for the bettering of technology, and it helps them economically... There is nothing wrong with it.

But surely by saying that it is better to lose an animal than a human you are also saying that animals are dispensable.

I am not saying that they enjoy doing what they do to animals but just that they are seen as dispensable.

I did not know that homeless people were offered to test drugs.

I think it would be good if a better way could be found to test drugs so that there would be no need for animal testing at all. Hopefully it will happen.

Jedi photographer - May the focus be with me.
[url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/devil_girl/]Photographs[/url]

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Devil Girl wrote:
Fetterthanyou wrote:
Devil Girl wrote:

I think it is sadly more to do with that animals are seen as being dispensable.

I'm 100% sure that some people do see animals this way, but I don't think that is the reason they do it. They do it because it is better to cause harm to an animal than another human. At least that is the idea, and I agree with that. If there really is the technology to test things in other ways, not only do they do that, but they also test it on the animals just to make sure.

They also test products on homeless people because they are willing to do anything for the money. Do you think that is wrong? Because I think that if they are willing to risk themselves for the bettering of technology, and it helps them economically... There is nothing wrong with it.

But surely by saying that it is better to lose an animal than a human you are also saying that animals are dispensable.

But the problem arises that as of now, we no other way.  And no, it's not saying that animals are dispensable but humans are indispensable.  There is a fine line there.

[i]Like I told your captain, the orphange attacked me.  It was self-defense.[/i]  -Richard the Warlock  [url]http://archive.lfgcomic.com/lfg0002.gif[/url]

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Yeah,say that after 50 years when the food chain will be broken and you won't have food to eat.

"Your passions give you strength, and through strength you gain power. You have seen it, you feel it. You must break your chains."

Re: Moral progatives and logical fallices.

Something like that will never happen as there are an abundance of animals that have meats that can be consumed.

[i]Like I told your captain, the orphange attacked me.  It was self-defense.[/i]  -Richard the Warlock  [url]http://archive.lfgcomic.com/lfg0002.gif[/url]