Topic: Can a "True Jedi" carry a blaster?

Ok im starting this topic due to recent events that transpired on the chat room.

I pose the question...

Can a "True Jedi" carry a blaster?

First, you may ask, what is a true Jedi? Well I believe it to be a Jedi who accepts the ways of the Jedi. And I mean the ways that the Jedi Temple describes and puts out. I mean Jedi like Mace Windu, Luke Skywalker, Yoda and Obi-wan Kenobi.

Now you may have noticed that TWO of the Jedi I have just mentioned have used blasters. Those occasions have been certain circumstances:

Luke Skywalker- Used blasters BEFORE he became a true Jedi. He got rid of his blaster in ROTJ when he became a Jedi Knight

Obi-wan Kenobi- Used a blaster to kill General Grievous. However, was it his blaster? No. Could he have used his lightsaber? No. Was he on the brink of death? Yes. He fact was, he either used the blaster or died and Grievous lived. It was an extreme case. And afterwards he did not enjoy the fact that he had to use it.

I believe that a true Jedi accepts the lightsaber as his only weapon. Which is why they train with lightsabers and only lightsabers. Not blasters or grenades. A true jedi is confident with his skill with the lightsaber and relies solely on that. A lightsaber is fit to take on any other saber or blaster, which is why they dont need blasters. It is more destructive than a thermal detonator, which is why you never see them on any Jedi's belt.

Cujo posed this to me, if the Jedi in question has no philosophical beliefs or religion then he can use what he wishes.

I say, if the Jedi in question has no philosophical beliefs or religion, then he is not a true jedi. He is not a Jedi at all. He is simply a force user. Jedi is a title, not a race. Jedi and Sith are force users, they are called Jedi or Sith due to their beliefs. If they have none, then they are not true Jedi.

Peter5158 posed this... Kyle Katarn and Jaden Korr have both used blasters.

Yet, this happened in games. Video games are barely canon at all. As Lord Revan put it, the events that transpire in them are. If the player chooses to use a blaster, so be it. However, in NO cutscene do you see the characters using blasters. They dont even acknowledge them in conversation. The blasters are there to be used for fun, it is not meant to be canon.

What do you think Fett Fans?

I have to think that you can be a true jedi and rely on other weapons...even more than the lightsaber. Especially when I think of Etain in the Republic Commando book by KT... She was a jedi that carried a Conc-rifle into battle and felt like she was more effective with it than she was with her lightsaber sometimes. The jedi mostly only use lightsabers because of tradition and the belief that they are a more civilized weapon. But there's nothing that I've ever heard any jedi say that would make me think they have to ONLY use lightsabers... its just something that most of them are trained to do, in accordance with jedi tradition.

                                                        BB* :cool:

Kyle Katarn  wasnt jedi in the start, and Jaden Korr somehow made a Lightsaber with out the force, which sould be impossible, because Jedi use the force to bond the materials at a molecular level so yeah, its just cause its a game.

SPOILER ALERT (for Knights of the Old Republic)

Revan used a blaster, but that was after his brain was wiped, and did anyone realy use blasters after they got their lightsabers? Realy now.

SPOILERS END HERE

...and so its come to this, and every man must face his inner demons. (cue the dramatic music).

ok enough of that.
like a sith im going to deal in absolutes. and will adhere to the universe that lucas and not his proxies have spun (ie- books, videogames, and comic where liberties r taken).

the movies at the pots and pans are cultural battles- ying and yang if you will.
nature vs technology (ewoks vs empire) (gungans vs driod army) and the conflict. if you recall lucas refused to
give up the franchise rights and control of starwars to major studios. so he has a natural aversion to "the man"
and paralells can be drawn in his movies.

the jedi represent- nobility and democracy- and the grace of the eastern culture in many ways. see meditation etc. it is most def a philosophy if not a religion as palpatine calls it in RotS. "the jedi and their dogmatic religion"
i am paraphasing his quote correct me if im wrong.
thus- yes i believe a jedi would scoff at using a blaster/ if for no other reason it is beneath them.
as for kenobi using a blaster on GG to end him, it was that or death by terminal velocity. i believe speilberg worte
the scene or at least directed it. (feel free to correct that)

to wrap this up i believe it was our own "draco" who very deftly pointed out in a topic about fett becoming a force user. a jedi that used blasters or det packs would be considered a "mary sue".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Sue
a character can be a polymath and skilled at all things but what is the fun in that.

a jedi can use blasters or anything he wants. the jedi is philosophical i admit but RELIGIOUS it is not. where has anyone ever said "it is against the rules to  use a blast or other weapons". Plenty of games havent had blasters you could use before or since if it was just for fun wouldnt it  be in every game.
If you ask me someone saying a true jedi doesnt use blasters or other weapons is discrimination and doesnt deserve to even talk if that is what they must say.

Ok, Peter, Jedi are religious, the darkside is like evil, and satan and all that.

ok now im 99% sure about what im about to say
since george lucas is not part of any of the official movie making guilds since Indiana jones  Speilberg and lucas cannot work together on a movie

now if you pat attention to the books, Jacen Solo, Jaina Solo, Mara Jade Skywalker, Leia Organa Solo, Luke Skywalker, and i believe Ben Skywalker, Corran Horn, Corran's son (i think his name is valin)  and several other jedi use blaster or weapons other than their lightsabers, mara is kinda obvious since she was an assassin, ben uses a vibroblade on a few occasions Corran's usese a rocket launcher on an occasion, and Jacen Jaina, Luke, and Leia have all used a blaster pistol at the same time as using their lightsaber

roll w/ the 1% on this one.
check the assistant director list. spielberg "action scene director"
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0121766/combined

im not saying a jedi shouldnt use a blaster but that is a whole other ball of wax.
hey if snake eyes a ninja(gi joe) can use an uzi, lets give all jedi a jetpack.
its a convolution of ideals.

He is the first assistant action scene director

so spielberg wouldnt have had as much say in the that scene as you would think

really because thats what this makes it seem like

so now Cujo it seems like you are contradicting yourself

because a lightsaber is not always the best tool for the job especially if you wish to go unnoticed

Ummmmm Val how is the jedi order a religion? they dont worship anything. The jedi order is a way of life. A way of life that allows blasters

Religion does not require worship of a diety.
However, they are followers of a path, they belive in something greater then them, the Force.

AA i admit that  but thats a way of life. Do they worship the force no.

But they follow its path, they have a good and a bad side, they try to redeem the fallen when thay can, they are told not to feel anger. Sounds like a religion to me.

Also Cujo, with the blaster/detonator thing, They view themselves as a force for peace, they try not to fight, when they can avoid it.  I agree with your break down of it that you quoted in your last post

interesting that this particular issue is something people r so passionate about.
anyway...

A Skirta- you may be correct about the duties of an assistant action director etc.
i only know what i read and hear. and i remember hearing speilberg had his hands all over the
kenobi GG battle scene. ill leave the speculating on how much to you.

as for "should a jedi use a blaster", if i was a jedi (which for the record) i am not. i would carry a ranged weapon.
that was the foundation for that statement.

and that last quote was not me homie, it was Valthonin.

as for the religion vs philosophy issue. as per my first post i am foggy on this as well. i try and get in the mind of lucas. and since he wrote the script for episode 3, where palpatine calls it "jedi" a religion. i think lucas did have in mind that the force as high power.
and it goes w/out saying it is not my intention to rattle any cages, or incite anyones ire.
part of the starwars universe that drives my nuts is its sloppy continuity, so there is much room for interpretation.

How is the Jedi Order a religion?

Like Cujo said, in RotS Palpatine clearly labels it as a religion. And as Adeptus said a religion does not need a central thing to worship. What is the headquarters of the Jedi called? The Jedi TEMPLE. Lucas intended the Jedi to be seen as a religion, and i see the movies more canon than anything else.

And as for the ligthsaber question...

That is from RotJ. A ligthsaber is a Jedi's weapon. And the only jedi weapon. A true Jedi relies only on his skill with the powerful ligthsaber. Not on other uncivilized weapons, as they view them. They dont carry around grenades or blasters or rocket launchers. They only use them in EXTREME situations where a lightsaber is not readily available. If they chose to use another weapon over a lightsaber they have at hand then they do not trust in their skills with the lightsaber or their Jedi training with the lightsaber so....they are not a true Jedi.

As Cujo said, Jedi are not meant to carry other weapons. Then they are basically Mary Sue's. And theres no fun in that.

Jedi aren't supposed to have blasters or other weapons because they are supposed to have SOME flaw as with every other person. They are supposed to be able to actually die. Your character in AoS is a Mary Sue

And by he way Peter...

Now YOU are insulting ME. If you dont like my opinion, then deal with it. But dont freak out and act like a child and not the 26 year old man you claim to be.

Just got to insult me dont you?

Also, loads of stuff in the Jedi code is ripped from several non-fiction religions (heavily Christianity) and smashed together.

"You, my friend, are all that remains of their religion."

Hear here. That was Governor Tarkin in ANH, clearly expressing that Jedi/Sith is INDEED a religion. And yeah, Palps said himself in RotS that it was a religion.

Anyways, True Jedi clearly don't use blasters. Luke used his in ESB (he never once fires it anyways) because he didn't have the greatest training with a lightsaber at that time, since Old Ben had him use a remote. And Obi-Wan had no choice in Episode 3, as he clearly did not have his lightsaber, and thus was near death.

Stop playing on the "You insulted me" game because you can't prove your point in this topic. I've proven you wrong so now you have to act the victim. How about you argue your opinion and stop acting like child Peter. You're not getting anywhere saying things like that.

They use alot of stuff from eastern religions i think.

I think it was some Eastern stuff, and a few old-European.  I, to add my two cents worth, even if I cannot support it very well :P, think that to be a True Jedi, one would have to be completely one with the Force and the lightsaber, which is, I believe, thought to be an extension of the body rather than a clunky weapon.  Blasters are cool and all, but their appeal lies mainly with non-Jedi/SIth characters.  Sure Jedi adn Sith use blasters and other such stuff in certain circumstances, but, as Valthonin said in post one of this topic,  Jedi like Obi-Wan, Yoda, Windu, and Luke Skywalker rarely, if ever, use a blaster in the movies after they have become Jedi, unless in dire need (GG vs. Kenobi) 

A self-respecting Jedi would want to show everyone that he or she does not need to rely on anything outside of their mind, body, and lightsaber.  And Sith, due to th arrogance that seems to follow certain ones, refuse to use anything but a blaster for the fact that they are better than that.  (Even though I like Sith better than Jedi)  If they want to be True Jedi/Sith, they typically use nothng but a lightsaer, as a blaster is too "clumsy and random", and not "civilized". 

Again, this is simply my opinion, based of of what I have observed from the movies.  I am not inending to offend anyone, or claim that I know everything.  I am simply stating an opinion. (And I admit, maybe I am wrong: opinions can be based off of mis-information :P)

So luke skywalker is not a true jedi?
you people all seem to forget that a lightsaber is not ideal for all situations, when use of a lightsaber will endager others, or draw unwanted attention to themselves or the order

and the jedi order is based upon many easter religions, i've writen a few papers about the religions behind jedi
and palpatine is not the only one to call it a religion Han Solo has as well

As I recal, Luke was not fully trained with sabers. Did you ever see him with a blaster in ROTJ?

like i said before, he never even uses his blaster in ESB. Sure, he holds it a few times, but never fires it, and eventually loses it.

In the books that take place after the movies he uses a blaster on many occasions as do many other jedi, and dont tell me stuff about the books being like the games where you can or cannot use a blaster, because GL has to approve of everything first

That's like saying "Can a true metal head have short hair?" I wouldn't want to see someone call the singer to Pantera non-metal.

So, I'd say they can have a blaster.

I honestly don't see a correlation to this topic.

I see what youre trying to say though, yet a lightsaber is significantly more important to a Jedi then long hair is to a metal head. A lightsaber is a Jedi's life, an extension of his body.

When a lightsaber is not ideal for a situation (which is rare) then the Jedi can rely on his force powers. The ability to move things at your will or confuse the minds of others with a thought is much more potent then a blaster.

Darth Vader puts it well here. Of course, a blaster does not compare to the Death Star, but its the same concept. If you cannot trust in your lightsaber, then you can trust in the Force.

And about Luke using a lightsaber in the books. At first, he wasnt one of the best lightsaber users out there... he trained with only a droid. He didnt have the extensive experience with lightsaber's or the Force that the other Jedi had. So, at times he probably had to make up for it with that.

i wish to call this simple ignorance
Jedi are not all powerful this has been proven time and again  for a jedi or sith for that mater to rely only on their force powers or their lightsaber is to hobble themselves

Ah yes, to not rely on a laser sword that can cut through nearly any material or their Force powers which allow them to move objects at their will or influence others with their mind or cast lightning from their fingertips or heal themselves or others or run at amazing speeds or jump and unbelievable heights would definitely be hobbling themsevles.

Describe a situation in which Force powers or a lightsaber could be superceded by a blaster.

you seem to forget that not all jedi have those powers Valthonin

I dont really want to post a spolier so read the latest legacy of the force book for one,
Another would be when trying to hide ones identity, because walking around with a lightsaber on your hip and using the force for every kinda makes you stand out

and yes using the force for everything does hobble them, it creates a distance between the order and the people that they have sworn to protect, thats why during the clone wars some jedi generals had the respect of the clone and non-clone unites in the GRA, and why Jacen has the respect/loyalty of his soldiers in the legacy of the force series

About the walking around with a lightsaber and being noticed thing, I thing its not that big of a deal if you have to hide them beneath your robes or somethng else. You dont have to have it out the whole time. You wouldnt stand out. And I neevr meant that they should use the force for everything. They should just use it when necessary. It is their most potent ability. yet they do not have to use it to open doors and turn pages of a book.

And I know that not all Force users can cast lightning or heal, i was just making a point.

When a Jedi needs to hide his identity, it isnt that hard. Maybe change out of your robes, and hide your lightsaber, no big deal.

Ok, I'm not saying the Jedi AREN'T a religion; I don't think they see themselves as following a religion, but that's apparently what Lucus based them on.  But my question is why are you all listening to the Emperor, Tarkin, AND Han Solo about what a Jedi is or isn't.  The first 2, especially Palps, are totally bent AGAINST the Jedi, and I always read his statements as his attempt to degrade the Jedi by calling it a religion.  Solo *did he ever all it a religion?* just donesn't know what he's talking about on the subject period, or at least he didn't at the time.

As to Jedi using blasters, I think they COULD, but just don't.  At least the Jedi of the Old Republic all seem to see blasters as beneath them.  It's like asking Boba to mind your tomato garden while you're gone for the week; it's something he'd be capable of...........just not something he's going to do.  There are always exceptions to rules, and I'm sure a couple Jedi have been blaster-packers even before the fall of the Republic, though I imagine they were looked down apon

That's my 2 cents

well stated.
a response-and as stated previous this is merely observation and at worst speculation.
sith r going to make jabs at jedi, just as Christians scoff at Muslim afterlife and vise versa etc. i think lucas purposfully grey the line of jedi and sith between philosohy and a religion. after all he created back when he could still write.
another thing to consider in this discussion is that there r angels in the starwars universe as well as a hell,
which solo said "well, then ill see you in hell!" while on hoth.

these conversations r material for many threads.

someone said earlier that lucas approves everything, so it must all be considered as canon.
dont get me started on continuity...(cujo is restrained and drug out of the room).

And hiding a lightsaber doesnt always mean it is readily available , sure some people have disguised them as glowrods, and hydrospanners but depending upon the disguise that the jedi is using those may not always work

and i agree Ralin Drakus on the fact that Jedi just dont use blasters all the time, for the fact that the order has no laws against using blasters, the lightsaber is the traditional jedi weapon, but its not always the most practical for all situations

And hair isn't? But yeah, I didn't really make a great point.

I don't see why a Jedi couldn't use an extra weapon.

You guys are all taking this as "In the Jedi rule book no blasters are allowed."

I didnt say that nor do i mean it.

I just mean that a true Jedi can go through any problems without a blaster. He can use his knoweldge of the force or his ligthsaber.

Now, I am not saying that Obi-wan is not a true Jedi because he used a blaster to kill GG. However, he did not choose a blaster over a lightsaber. He did not have a lightsaber at hand. He had to use the blaster. I just believe that, in my opinion that is, a true Jedi uses the Force and a lightsaber to make his way about the universe, not a blaster. They don't need them, they dont use them, they shouldn't have them. If they have a blaster on them at all times then that means that they dont trust in their ability with a lightaber and/or the Force, so they are not a true jedi. Like when Luke had a ligthsaber as well as a blaster in ESB, he was not a true Jedi and did not completely trust his skill with a lightsaber.

actually i beleive that we are on the opposite side of that line, because you seem to be saying that real jedi dont use blasters and any jedi that does is not a ture jedi
so i think your the one thats preaching about a jedi rule book

Well I don't think there's such a thing as a "True Jedi". So, any Jedi can use a blaster. They just prefer lightsabers.

This seems to me as a complicated topic, depending on definitions to many things that are open for individual interpretation. What is a True Jedi? Are there True Jedi? If we are talking about blasters and Jedi, whether The Jedi/ Sith are religious or not seems moot. An interesting topic for sure, but just not connected to the blaster debate to me.

Many of the Jedi that have been brought forth as examples for carrying a blaster or ranged weapons were unsure of skills or position within the formal Jedi Order of the Old Republic. They either were not fully trained in lightsaber combat, like Luke in ESB or doubted their skills with the Force ar some point, like Etain. What I would consider a "True Jedi" would be a Jedi that fully adheres to the Jedi Code, has stronglly developed Jedi Skills like lightsaber construction and combat and has a sense of comitment to the light side of the Force. That being said I feel like a "True Jedi" to that definition would be hesitant to use a blaster or ranged weapon. They would use them if absoultely necessary, like with GG V Obi- Wan or if it was absolutely vital to the success of an undercover mission. Given a choice though they would always reach for their personal lighsaber. They crafted it and should feel and be an extention of one's self, thus making it most comfortable.

I think a true Jedi would only rely on their lightsaber, as previously stated I think only a dire situation would call for a blaster.

Thats what I think as well, as in if they were unable to get close enough to attack with the lightsaber, or the like, True Jedis will only use the force, and their lightsabers, unless in dire circumstances, as Obi-Wan demonstrated

I think that most Jedi's at some point in time have had to use one. I dont think it was a big deal so long as they dont become dependiant on it.

Do you think that if a situation warrented and a Jedi used a blaster for either defense of himself or others would he be exspelled from the Jedi Order?

Was Obi-Wan?

no, to both questions, because remember batteries die, and thats what lightsabers run off of, and as i have stated in my prior arguments in this topic, lukes jedi use blasters frequently

Lightsabers only lose power when the beam is broken, so they dont use power that much

Read the rest of that post. If you understood it then you would not be saying that. I'm not preaching about anything.

Then there is your answer. If one can not be ousted from the order for using the blaster than it is a matter of choice for the Jedi.

Very good point. I would say that the "older" jedi wouldnt use a blaster but the newer era of jedi seem to have adapted. I would also put Obi-Wan as the "changing of the guard" he might be old but alot of his views were that of a newer jedi. The times changed so the jedi had to adapt or they would have died off for sure.

Obi-Wan's case has already been argued. It was a very dire situation, he had no other choice.

I know luke carried a heavy blaster pistol ( like han Solo's ) in ESB when he was about to face Vader :O